January 8, 2008
Planning Board Minutes Special Meeting
Oswego Town Hall
Chair: Jeffrey Boyer
Town Board Members: Judy Sabin-Watson, Francis Dellamano,
Lee Phillips, Barry Pritchard, James Finn
Attorney To The Board: Stephen Greene, Jr.
At approximately 7:00 PM, Jeffrey Boyer, Chairman called the Meeting to order.
Those in attendance were:
Approval of December 17, 2007 Minutes:
The only question Jeff had because of being absent from the last meeting, is the public comment from Mario Rabozzi. He wondered what his relationship was with Oswego Hots Restaurant. Kevin said he is a neighbor about 3 houses down. Judy Watson made a motion that we approve the Minutes. Lee Phillips seconded it. All Ayes. Motion carried.
Application #2007-14 - David Washburn - Oswego Hots - Site Plan Review:
Jeff said at the conclusion of the last meeting, Fran said we needed a survey showing parking and the sign. Dave said they decided they weren’t going to apply for the sign out by the road. He said it is an expense they cannot afford right now. The sign is no longer an issue. Jeff said therefore we are down to the plot plan as far as parking. Fran said the map they had given us was not good enough. So they went and did a site plan through John Damiano. Kevin asked to see a copy of the first letter from the County Planning Board - December 10th. Kevin quoted that the County Planning Board recommended approval with modifications - that the applicant re-submit a site plan drawn to scale clearly showing ingress and egress, parking spaces, internal circulation and location of advertising signs relative to 104 and Baylis Street. The sketch that had been submitted did not give the Board enough information to make an intelligent decision. So we asked Mr. Washburn to hire a surveyor to plot it out. They got that back quite timely. Marge submitted it to the County again. The second letter indicated that it is not really necessary, and now they have made some additional comments. It appears that the four southerly parking spaces appear to be in the State’s right-of-way. The County is recommending that they should be removed. They are also commenting that the interior circulation may be problematic. This is a second recommendation from the County. Kevin said that he spoke to Sean Murphy, who is a Regional Planner with the NYS DOT. He was able to get to Mr. Murphy with the Site Plan, as well as all the information that the Washburn’s had submitted, including the written comment from James Tompkins, who is the Assistant Resident Engineer from the DOT. He is located in Mexico and did a field study. Mr. Murphy said if Mr. Tompkins believes there aren’t any issues, that he would support what Mr. Tompkins has written. The one thing he did say, and it is consistent with the County Planning Board - he couldn’t tell where the State’s right-of-way began. His only comment was that if any portion of the business that is located in the State’s right-of-way, they would have an objection to that portion of it. He indicated that because it is an existing commercial space, it is not being expanded, he did not have a particular concern with the use. The only other issue he raised was accessing the premises from 104 heading East, essentially making a left turn and going across 104. He said that could be problematic from the State’s position. He said he would rather see the property clearly delineated with ingress and egress so they are directing the outflow onto Baylis, as much as possible.
Fran stated that a lot of the customers will be from the college. He asked if it would be delivery orders. Dave said a lot of the college will be walking and taking orders with them. Fran asked how many tables and chairs will be in there, and Dave said they will have seating for 29 - we have 4 booths and 5 tables. Fran said that will be 6 or 7 cars.
Fran asked for an explanation as to why they left grass here (pointing to the map). Dave said they planned to put picnic tables there, as it is a nice shady spot, but it is also our property line, so we didn’t want to pave over in there. Plus the city comes down here with the sidewalk (again pointing to map). Lee said he had been there recently and there was a contractor’s truck there and a couple of cars. He said he came in from 104 with no trouble and exited Baylis street with no problem.
Judy asked Kevin if there would be a problem approving the site plan due to the fact that part of it is on State property? Kevin said it could be a problem unless the Washburn’s receive some sort of a waiver from the State. What Sean Murphy said he couldn’t tell where the State’s right-of-way began because it isn’t specifically delineated on this map. If we can get John Damiano to show where the State right-of-way is, they might get a letter from Mr. Murphy stating that they have no objection to parking in these four spaces here (indicating on map).
After much discussion among Kevin, Judy and Fran, a Motion was made by Judy that we approve the Site Plan of December 27, 2007, with only the parking spaces that are contained within the owner’s property lines. A revised map will be submitted showing the owner’s appropriation lines. In the future, if the owners wish to pursue with the State for the parking spaces on their property, the Site Plan could be amended. Jim Finn seconded the motion. All ayes. Motion carried.
Kevin said he and Marge will work on the motion as well as the Resolution.
Fran said he would like to bring up one more thing on this whole procedure. We had a Public Hearing. No one spoke against the proposal. One person was here to speak in favor, and one person wrote in favoring it. Fran said that should be in the minutes, to show that it was advertised, and it was positive in an area of residential people. 192 Certified Letters were sent to the people within 1,500 feet, and we didn’t have any outcries.
Judy said there was a question at the last meeting about the Stout property. We wanted to know what was approved way back when, so she pulled his file. He is in an R-4 District, and what he came to us for was requesting a Special Permit for a business, and that was he was granted. He is in an R-4 District and not in an Ag area. Fran said the question was in the survey, “Is your boundary within 500 feet if an Ag?” Judy said there was a question about the original Site Plan and what it had requested, and that is what she researched. Judy said there was a question about getting a copy of a Variance, and he did not have a Variance - he had a Special Permit. He is in an R-4 area so he can build his apartments. Jim Finn asked if a Special Use Permit follows the property, or follows the owner. Judy said it is the property.
New Business: None
Public Comment: None
Open Board Discussion:
Judy said we should discuss is issues that have happened the last few times about things going on in the town, and this one being a good example of it, is us not having an opportunity to look at a Site Plan before these people have put in all this money. She proposed that we submit a Resolution to the Town Board requesting that when a business entity is coming into the town, that we be informed of what is taking place and we make the decision as to whether we want to see a Site Plan or not. Fran said we will have to word it different than that. Judy said the problem is businesses that are going into an area - that we have already given them a Variance or Special Use Permit, and they are being told by Code Enforcement. And this poor guy gets ready to open and we hit him with “You have to come and see us”. The Town Board would have to do it by Resolution, and changing the way they do business.
Kevin said his rule of thumb, particularly commercial uses should come before this Board for Site Plan Review, whether a formal approval is needed or not, this Board should know what is going on. Fran said he thinks it is important, even if someone is going to have a household business, especially for adequate parking spaces. Jim Finn said at least they will be starting with us, instead of putting thousands of dollars into their business, and finding out they have to put a few more to satisfy these people. Judy said we looked real intelligent with this poor gentleman. Luckily he has a sense of humor, because he could have gotten really angry with us. She said she would like to try to avoid that again.
Lee said “Why don’t we get a specific list as to what we are supposed to do?” Judy said she is trying to do a stop gap now before we do the new zoning. Hopefully, when we do the new zoning, we will have learned from our errors.
Kevin said Wayne should be referring any business use to this Board for an initial review. Judy said she wants to see a Resolution drawn, as that is the only way that it can change, because there is no procedure for that to happen now.
Jeff said what we need to do is get the words right again. From his understanding we are requesting the Town Board to pass a Resolution. Judy said her suggestion would be for the Planning Board to send a letter to the Town Board requesting a Resolution - that all business uses including home businesses shall be referred to the Planning Board to see if Site Plan Review is necessary. Jeff said he would come up with a letter, and he would get it to Kevin or Steve for any changes.
At approximately 8:00 PM, Fran Dellamano made a motion to adjourn the meeting. Judy Watson seconded the motion. All ayes. Motion carried.
Secretary to Planning Board